Hi all
Brand new in the community, and from France (so please excuse my poor English !)
I’ve been reading all BITD material I could put my hand on for a few months now, and I have to say that it has been hard for me to come to grips with some aspect of the system (especially the absence of difficulty levels). But the positive things in the system and the whole game are too many to ignore. I just have to find players now.
I have one question and one comment:
– The question : armor. Does armor (both light and heavy) bring only ONCE (or twice for heavy) a benefit in any score (When you check the box) ? Or do you also take your armor into account each time you estimate your position in a fight (desperate, risky, controlled) ? So the box-checking is just added benefit ?
– The comment : about Tier.
Tier appears to me to be “too much” simplified. Especially when you have to take it into account in a challenge/fight. I have read on many posts in this community that it symbolises training, gear, scale, influence of the faction. But this is not consistent. The Red Sashes have “master sword-fighters” (good training), they are “very well connected”… but only Tier II. Would a master sword-fighter from them be at disadvantage in a duel against a Leviathan Hunter (Tier V) captain from the nobility… that he has maybe trained ? The Skov refugees are desperate, poor refugees, no training, no contacts… but Tier III.
Moreover the training of the foe is already dealt with in NC threat levels (page 167), so should not come into play when you estimate your Position or Effect. Or it would be double punition for the PCs.
My take is that the factions should have not one number to mechanically characterise them, but at least two to : Scale, Gear. Training would be in the fiction and could vary inside the faction.
I don’t know if i have been clear enough. Thanks for your input.
Hey, welcome to Blades and the community!
Tier reflects the power of the group collectively. Skovland refugees are a huge group with a lot of ties to the ethnic ghetto. The Red Sashes are martially dangerous but not a very large gang and don’t have big turf.
Tier is a factor when you’re acting against the faction as a whole (as in doing a job against them). As you pointed out, threat levels are relevant in personal conflicts. Tier is relevant to Engagement rolls.
Hope that helps!
Also, p.33: “When an armor box is marked, it can’t be used again until it’s restored. All of your armor is restored when you choose your load for the next score. “
I would sometimes factor armour into events later in the score.
For example: A member of crew gets knocked from the deck of a leviathan hunter and has to swim to a row boat. Thats risky, but if we’ve established in the fiction that he’s in armour, then that’s desperate…
Usually though armour is a one time thing.
Rebecca W Yes, it helps. Indeed, I saw the thing a bit like that. But I thought I had read in another post that John Harper himself counted the difference in tier even in personal conflicts (iot abstract NPC’s armor etc).
Declan Feeney + Rebecca. So for you armor box is checked once or twice as in the rules but does not count for any other fights to estimate position. OK ; I’ll try to ingest that. I have to say it does not accord really well with the fiction in my mind.
Re the armour. I’m not sure what sort of thing you’re talking about when you say “estimate position”, but let’s try an example. I’m wearing heavy armour, which I’ve already fully marked. Someone comes at me completely unarmed, and tries to punch me with their bare fists.
I think if I were unarmoured that would be a risky situation. They could hurt me pretty badly even with bare fists.
I think that wearing my heavy armour, it’s a controlled situation. I’m wearing heavy armour, they pretty much can’t hurt me unless they pin me down and pull my armour off. I think this is true even with the armour checked off – the armour hasn’t vanished, it just isn’t providing me with its full benefits. I’m still basically invulnerable to bare fists.
But even as I say this I feel a bit of doubt. What does the check mark represent? Do I have a massive hole in my armour from an axe strike? If so, the fist-fighter could punch me there. Perhaps if my opponent is a champion boxer or martial artist or something, I’ll keep the position as risky.
Is this the sort of thing you meant?
Joshua Fox That’s exactly what I was pondering. Must we use the amor to estimate our Position each time we fight (comparing our amor and the opponent’s weapons), which will have the effect of reducing our Harm each time if we go from desperate to risky to controlled thanks to our armor, or must we ONLY reduce the Harm ONCE when we check the box (Twice for heavy armor). In the first case the two amor boxes are ADDED benefits of the amor, which provide permanent benefit even if we do not check the box. In the second case, the amor brings benefit ONLY when we check the boxes.
Your opinion on this seem not to be the same as Rebecca’s and Declan’s. So it is confusing at least…
I don’t think the armour reduces the harm mechanically every time, you only get that benefit if you check the box. But I think it might nevertheless have the fictional effect of preventing certain things from harming you.