POTENTIAL BLOODLETTERS SPOILERS!!!
So, in Ep 7-2, at around 47:40, Arcy wants to make a desperate Command roll vs Baz. John mentions that it’s only possible due to the past six sessions culminating in the crew being Tier 2 with a reputation for murder, but that if it was the first session it would be a project. This confuses me.
If it’s the first session, could Arcy not make a Desperate Command roll vs Baz with zero effect, provided she resisted anything sent he her way? AFAIK, Tier only affects effect, not position.
If something is so far beyond your tier that tackling it would be impossible, the GMs responsibility is to make up a path to making it possible. In this case, commanding someone with such an enormous lead in social status and ability is as close to impossible as it gets between two mortals.
See the rules for engagements or crafting rules as an example. Sometimes the tier difference is so steep that even a suicidal attack would require more effort or resources to attempt.
My read is that fictionally, you can’t just walk up and Command Baz to do squat. You need either dirt on him or something to threaten him with (obtained via a score or project to find a vulnerability) as leverage.
The Bloodletters rep and tier, i.e. their passed actions, substitute for that (in the same way that say, Scurlock’s rep would).
Yes, what +Dan Voyce said, if the Players just say “I want to go kill the Emperor” and I’m going to do a setup action and then push for effect and oh look, I rolled a crit, so viola, I just went from zero effect to great and now the Immortal Emperor is on his deathbed…BAM”. It’s really the GMs job to back up and say …. but wait… how are you getting to him, and what weapon do you have that could possibly harm him, etc.
So when John said you’d need a clock, that wasn’t to say we’d have to do a long term action. It just meant we’d probably have to make many attempts (putting ticks on the clock) to win Bazso over, rather than do it with a single action. A great example of this is when the Last Word is out in the Deathlands and they try to kill lord Succor (sp?) and he has a clock called “Defenses” which has to be ground down before they can even attempt the killing blow. Not that any clocks were going to get in the way of those fiends!
Sean, that’s what I thought, thanks. A progress (“project” threw me off, as well as other bits) clock makes total sense. As far as the Tower & Demon, I don’t think it applies to this. If your Tier 0 crew is invited to Bazso’s lair for work and you flashback to why you’re here to kill him, you should at least have a chance (barring any supernatural things). He’s a tough, well-connected man but still just a man.
A progress clock to take him out? Desperate actions? Zero or at best limited effect? All those make sense. What doesn’t is not even being able to try.
Yeah, I think that was just John saying “you’d have to start a clock” but it would also have been totally acceptable to say you have zero effect. All of that is in the GMs discretion. It’s totally fine to say you would handle those situations differently that John.
I can totally see a Paolo (the Howlers, in Dishonored 2) situation with Bazso Baz. Oooh…yep! That is happening. >:]
Sean Nittner , I love getting into the weeds because John’s showcasing the rules as your group plays, which helps immensely. If there is a RAW/right way I want to know it, then break it if needed. If it’s a better way I may steal it, and so on. I’m a LOT more comfortable with running the game but still enjoy seeing and reading how others do things.
I mean, there are certainly less and more clear cases, but I don’t think their is a “right way” to decide on position and effect, or to decide on what kind of roll is needed (action, fortune, etc). John says to have a discussion and who gets the final say (e.g. players pick actions, gm’s pick position/effect, etc.) but there’s not way to be prescriptive about saying this has to be one way or the other.
Good example: In that game of the Last Word Aldo took a Devil’s Bargain to crash through the door and have everyone’s eyes on him. John ruled that the attention counted as a setup action (TWICE!) for Cariless and gave him improved effect because of it. In my game I wouldn’t have counted that as setup, and even if I did, once Cariless got the benefit of it and hurt Succor, I would have said his attention shifts to the real threat in his face. “All eyes on Aldo” does’t mean people are magically locked onto him and can’t acknowledge other threats. And to top that off, that was a devil’s bargain, not a desired effect! I would have just said “dudes pile on you, a ghost comes after you, and Succor gives you the evil eye!”
When I mentioned “right way” I was referring to any actual mechanics and how they interact. For example, the steps during downtime that, if not followed properly, might give weird results. That doesn’t mean you can’t change things, of course, I just like knowing rules/author intention/best practices/etc. before we mangle them. I absolutely love the challenge of learning Blades and how others set the dials.
It’s not just the system that’s new to me, it’s the overall style of play. I was used to playing, and eventually running, completely immersive games. No meta, no OOC stuff, no player agency, etc. Personally, I’ve come to find it exhausting and annoying in so many ways that would take up too much time to post. I’m by no means pooping on that style of play, I just don’t like it very much now. It’s been awesome seeing how different group handle this play style.
“The Tower and the Demon” text is still in there. It’s on page 25, as the example text under Dominant Factors.
And yeah, Sean Nittner, I mis-played that Devil’s Bargain with Aldo and Lord Sukur. My attention kind of lapsed and I didn’t hit it as hard as I should have.
Cool, glad that text is still there (I was on my phone and couldn’t check, hence also the spelling errors).
And the thing with Lord Sukur illustrates one of the best things in Blades.The explicit permission to make a call one way and later say “actually, I don’t think that is right” and fix it either retroactively or just for the future.
Halfway through ep 8-1, getting a great look at things. I really liked the conversation about how Lovecraftian to set the dials.